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Michael Beschloss: FBI Knew ‘Exactly’ Who Oswald Was, But ‘Never Bothered’ To Warn Secret ServiceAdm

MSNBC

Updated on Jan 21,2023

Michael Beschloss: FBI Knew ‘Exactly’ Who Oswald Was, But ‘Never Bothered’ To Warn Secret Service

Administration is releasing more than 13,000 records tied to President John F,Kennedy's assassination but withholding,thousands more citing National Security,concerns the documents revealed that Lee,Harvey Oswald who said weeks earlier in,Mexico he wanted to kill Kennedy was,being closely tracked by both the CIA,and FBI why weren't these documents,released years earlier in 1963 if,Americans had seen this stuff they might,have said you know why did the FBI and,CIA let our president be assassinated,one document shows that the CIA,intercepted a phone call Oswell made to,the Soviet Embassy in Mexico City weeks,before the assassination on a wiretap,arranged with the help of Mexico's,president why wasn't any of that,information quickly passed on to,Washington so the Secret Service could,act to make sure that this man Oswald,wasn't a threat to the president of the,United of the United States on that,fateful day the president and first lady,Jacqueline Kennedy arrived arrived in,Texas on a campaign swing riding in a,limo through downtown Dallas shots,ringing from a third floor window,President Kennedy,died at approximately one o'clock,Central Standard Time Oswald was,arrested and charged with the murder but,a short time later in a Dallas police,station he was shot and killed by Jack,Ruby as stunned Americans watched live,on NBC,he's been shot he's been shot Lee Oswald,has been shot the Warren Commission,concluded Oswald acted alone but over,the decades Kennedy's assassination has,spawned countless conspiracy theories,dramatized in movies like Oliver Stone's,JFK why was Kennedy killed who benefited,who has the power to cover it up John,Kennedy's assassination sadly will never,be fully solved that was probably,cinched the day that Lee Harvey Oswald,was killed in that police station in,Dallas,and joining me now is NBC News,presidential historian Michael beschlas,Michael,so what do you think are the biggest,outstanding questions,in what was not released it redacted,well I think I think two things that I,think the future documents may actually,show us a little bit more about this but,it will never never settle the question,for everyone one is you know Oswald was,in amazingly close touch with people,from the Soviet Union not only as a so a,Defector to the Soviet Union who,redefected came back to Dallas in 1962,but also went to that Soviet Embassy in,Mexico and the same thing with the Cuban,Embassy so LBJ in 1963 dealing with all,this the last thing he would have wanted,was to have a lot of information out at,that time suggesting that Oswald may,have acted on behalf of the Soviets and,the Cubans because as Johnson said in,his private tapes Americans will demand,that I get into a war that could kill 60,million people so he saw it as a,political problem,the other side of this was that as we,now see in document after document uh,the FBI in Dallas which was not a very,big City compared to now in those days,was tracking Lee Harvey Oswald and his,family to the point that Oswald not long,before the assassination was complaining,to FBI agents that they were bothering,his wife they knew exactly who he was,knew that he was a Soviet Defector knew,who he was in touch with yet FBI never,bothered to tell the Secret Service get,this guy out of the Texas School Book,Depository because the president's,limousine is going to be within rifle,range of that building for nearly a,minute so if Americans had found that,out in 1963 they might have said why did,the FBI let our president be killed and,put him in such a vulnerable position,and do you have you figured out why the,FBI did not win the Secret Service,one reason is bureaucratically in those,days and it's less now and it's improved,after 9 11 and the Department of,Homeland Security remember which the,commission said that there were too many,silos that led to 911 well there was,almost hatred between J Edgar Hoover and,the Secret Service of 1963. so he didn't,want to tell the Secret Service very,much and the other intriguing question,is we know that Edgar Hoover hated,Kennedy it was very close to Linda,Johnson who was his neighbor in,Washington I'm not suggesting that he,deliberately did this but you know there,may have been benign neglect that Hoover,may have said okay if Kennedy is going,to do these things that I don't like,maybe I'm not going to strain too hard,to protect him especially in a city like,Dallas where the violence of the radical,right had been expressed,and when you think about all of this the,president of Mexico helped the CIA with,surveillance of Oswald they were,tracking him they knew exactly where it,was I mean it just seems,the two together were taking pictures of,coming to those embassies there were,pictures of Oswald literally on the,doorstep uh we believe that there were,tapes of what he might have said with,them on the telephone so there's a big,history of Oswald dealing with the,Soviets and the Cubans before Dallas,1963. just as there is of the FBI and,CIA not doing

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Discussion with Michael Beschloss and Andrea Mitchell

Discussion with Michael Beschloss and Andrea Mitchell

ladies and Gentlemen please welcome to,the stage Michael beschlas and Andrea,Mitchell,as they say in my former business Andrea,I yield to the gentlewoman from,the world,to say that film was extraordinary it's,such a deserved tribute to everyone who,put it together everyone at the National,Archives,thank you Governor Blanchard for you,well to two,Two Fine words but uh too many fine,words about me because we're honoring,Michael and the secretary Slater and,Olivia my Gradle friend from NBC days,before she was at ABC David pereiro it's,wonderful to be with you,and of course with Bill Webster and,Linda Webster and all my friends a,little known fact about Alan Greenspan,and Bill Webster is that they were,tennis Partners they had to create a new,category,at the tennis club in the tournament for,80 plus competitors in the doubles,tournament and they share the same,birthday,and and both really good and they they,were both great so,well Michael this is your night and I,just want to share I was going to start,by asking Michael how did you become an,historian well I think we know from the,letter of eight-year-old Michael,beschlas,well,we've received,an email,which starts dear friend,saw Peter Baker's tweet this morning of,course the chief Washington,correspondent White House correspondent,for the New York Times and wanted to,offer dads in my warmest congratulations,on your honor this evening,no one is more deserving,your Miss Brahm is no doubt quietly,smiling and so proud of her young charge,never forget the imprint you made upon,her too with congratulations and the,greatest affection Chris,who is the son she's that Chris is the,daughter of my first grade teacher,uh okay it's a female a female Miss,Brown was her mother she became Mrs,Condon before she was born,uh and she invited the whole first grade,class to her wedding Infant Jesus of,Prague Flossmoor Illinois,and the other thing that you know people,wonder what teachers do,for they don't do this anymore I was in,the first grade they had me skip,kindergarten so I was four years old,so I was in that class with,six-year-olds who were probably you know,five inches taller than I was I was not,the first to be chosen for teams on the,playground,uh but her mother made sure that I was,always treated respectfully and nicely,and had a great year and lots of friends,and so,her mother died early but Chris as you,can see I'm still in touch with so thank,you for reading that out Andrew well,that we've all had teachers like that,I'm sure that just tells you about the,Early Education and the imprint that a,wonderful teacher can make on any child,and I'm wondering how how long ago did,you first start working,foreign,well when I was growing up if I had,known about an evening like this this,would have been like Woodstock for me,I may not look like Jimi Hendrix but I,feel like him tonight forgive the,historical reference uh but I wanted to,do this pretty much since I was about 10,years old,it was the time of the Civil War,Centennial and also something that I,think,Jim and David and Patrick and Rodney,have all said in allelia which is that,if you were growing up in the early,1960s presidents seemed pretty important,to you know I remember that Cuban,Missile Crisis which was 60 years ago,this week I was growing up outside of,Chicago and,it was explained to me my my parents how,dangerous this was and I said is this,like a tornado because three or four,times the summer we'd go down into the,cellar and maybe come up and the house,wasn't there that never happened to us,but sometimes did happen or I remember,being in summer camp in northern,Wisconsin,when Johnson became president my great,friend over here in LBJ and uh,it always looked I had a,this is so self,caricaturing I hope you don't mind this,but it's true and it doesn't reflect,that well on me I was the only kid in,the summer camp with a subscription to,the air edition of The Chicago Tribune,in Northern so it came two days late in,those days for the younger people there,was no internet version at the time and,they kept on having what I thought was,like the same photograph on the cover on,the front page of the Chicago Tribune,day after day and this was the summer of,65 LBJ signing all these pieces of,legislation it looked like with the same,people and I love the fact that I got to,see one of those bills being signed uh,one of the bills that was signed,upstairs,and uh Patrick and David and all of your,colleagues they did not know that that,was that connected directly to my life,as a nine-year-old but it really did and,I loved it which brings me to why why,why you think the National Archives are,so important to us to our history to our,culture to our society well I mean this,is this is almost a religious experience,for me because I think in in America if,you go back to the founders you know we,know a lot about them but there's one,thing that I think is less well known,and that is that,we all know that they wanted to develop,a political syst

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She was a monarch during a time that was very tough for women, says Michael Beschloss

She was a monarch during a time that was very tough for women, says Michael Beschloss

in seven decades as the british monarch,queen elizabeth ii ruled through the,cold war the assassination of jfk the,landing on the moon the fall of the,berlin wall the death of princess diana,and most recently that devastating,pandemic,her reign lasted so long that nine of,ten people alive on the planet today,were born after she became queen,historical perspective now from our,friend nbc news presidential historian,michael beschloss i've been looking,forward to talking to you all day a,queen for the ages but but how in the,world does history wrap itself around,her,well i think the real question to ask is,you know is her stature and the degree,to which she is beloved,around the world,would that have happened to anyone who,would have been monarch of england,during the last 70 years or was that,because she was such a spectacular,leader and i would suggest option two,this is someone as you well know who was,born in the 1920s to,a father who was not expected to be king,only did so because his brother,abdicated and then suddenly she becomes,queen,the age of 26 1952,not a spectacular education she had she,was the first to say yet,she gives what is by almost all accounts,extremely wise advice to,winston churchill and other prime,ministers harry truman and dwight,eisenhower and other american presidents,loved around the world as she presides,over the dissolution of the british,empire she didn't always do it perfectly,but i think what we should be grateful,for,we americans and everyone around the,world is that this is the person who,happened to be a monarch and especially,at a time that was tough for women she,did it flawlessly as if there were other,people to clear the way for her which,there really weren't no there weren't,she's 13 presidents she met,which of those if one stands out for you,uh i think the most interesting is,probably her meeting with john kennedy,in,1961 largely because there's a version,of it in the series the crown don't know,if you've seen that ship that has almost,no connection to reality,but it sure had personalities look at,the four of them,they shouldn't have had to fictionalize,because just combining those four people,would have been enough and it also shows,something else that i think was not in,the crown if i remember correctly,jackie kennedy had a sister named lee,lee radziwill lived near buckingham,palace the kennedys asked for lee rad's,will to be invited for their dinner with,the queen and at first the queen said no,because in those days queens did not,entertain divorced people,at buckingham palace the prime minister,harold macmillan intervened look at how,things have changed in 60 60 years wow,have they ever and she's helped it along,i so wish we had more time maybe i'll,give you a ring michael beschloss would,love it thank you we'd love to talk,thank you

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Michael Beschloss On Resisting Threats To Democracy

Michael Beschloss On Resisting Threats To Democracy

it's sickening,to see the new attacks in the fbi,threatening life with law enforcement,agents and their families for simply,carrying out the law and doing their job,there's no place in this country no,place,for endangering the lives of law,enforcement you turn on the television,and see senior senators and congressmen,saying if such and such happens,there will be blood in the street,where the hell are we as i stand here,tonight,equality and democracy,are under assault,we do ourselves no favor to pretend,otherwise donald trump and the migrant,republicans,represented extremism,that threatens the very foundations of,our republic,president biden has been pulling no,punches these last few weeks and he,certainly didn't last night with,independence hall as his backdrop biden,warned about the threat to democracy,posed by trump in his maga movement just,hours after the former president,suggested,he would pardon january 6 rioters if,given the chance,back with us tonight author and,historian presidential historian michael,beschloss his latest work is presidents,of war michael great to see you as one,of the historic as one of the historians,who warned president biden about a,teetering democracy how did he do last,night,i think he did great and by the way,i should mention we historians were not,asked to give political advice,this was a month ago we were asked to,come and talk to the president about,democracy which four or five of us did,for about two hours,and what president biden i think did,last night is,it's one of the highest callings that a,president can follow and that is to warn,americans when their democracy is in,danger that's what abraham lincoln did,in 1860 on the eve of the civil war,that's what franklin roosevelt did in,the 1930s when there were fascists like,father charles coughlin the radio priest,who was,preaching the need for a christian,republic he was saying that there should,be,boycotts of jewish businesses that you,didn't need elections roosevelt was,saying fascism is a bad thing,sometimes people don't like to hear what,a president says but president biden has,seen everything that we've seen in the,last couple of years all the warning,signs that have led our nbc poll to say,that the biggest issue facing voters is,threats to democracy,you know michael the thing that i found,interesting about the speech last night,is that this is part of a continuing,message that biden has been giving since,he announced his run for president in,2019 and i bring that up because i just,wonder he brought you in to talk about,democracy,but it strikes me that he,he was an eager and willing student was,he trying to figure out his place in,history when it comes to fighting for,democracy,uh i think not as self-consciously as,that i think you know if there and and i,don't know how he used this meeting,but uh i i can tell you what the meeting,was was very bleak in saying that,democracy is as much in danger,uh at this moment as it was in 1860 and,1940. i certainly believe that for,and if you didn't have a president,saying to americans look,we've got some big problems big issues,inflation you know all sorts of things,health care taxes,but overwhelmingly if we don't have a,democracy in two years we can't do,anything about any of those,right you know my colleague at the,washington post eugene robinson wrote,biden chose the perfect stage but the,president's critics called the event,dark and divisive how did last night's,speech compare to those of past,presidents,well,perfect question jonathan uh i think,anyone who would have heard lincoln in,1858 saying that this nation is a house,divided half slave and half free you,can't get very much more divisive than,that or franklin roosevelt in the late,30s saying that there are fascists among,among us who are dangerous or in 1940,saying we americans have to choose,whether or not to arm ourselves to fight,hitler in the imperial japanese pretty,divisive but that's part of the job,you know i want to get you on the the,classified documents controversy you,tweeted,those empty folders are on ominous,what else has you worried right now,well the first thing that has me worried,is you know just as you're saying,jonathan those empty folders,where are those documents,this was you know let's just think of,the worst and there's no evidence for,this yet but let's say that the,ex-president was selling them or handing,them to our enemies or even to our,friends who should not have had those,he could have done that without giving,the physical documents,so what makes this ominous is not only,the fact that,our some of our most classified national,secrets have very possibly gotten into,the wrong hands but what was going on,here that the documents have just,disappeared,one of the things a great nation does is,keep control of its secrets the united,states of america is a great nation,why is this so reckless and sloppy as if,it's amateur hour or worse,and michael it's the labor day weekend,before the midterms what a

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Michael Beschloss: This Hearing Is About As Historic As It Gets

Michael Beschloss: This Hearing Is About As Historic As It Gets

chanting,for the vice president to be hung,let's bring in former aid to the george,w bush white house and state departments,elise jordan host of the podcast on,brand with donnie deutsch danny deutsch,nbc news presidential historian michael,beschloss and professor in law at,georgetown university paul butler he is,a former federal,prosecutor michael beschloss we'll start,with you how historic is this,uh,this is about as historic as it gets uh,you have to look you know i've spent a,lot of time looking at a lot of,testimony by all sorts of people before,congress complaining about things that,presidents have done,i don't know of anything more shocking,than what i heard yesterday and i think,it's going to change history because,i can't see how this does not compel,mark meadows and others around donald,trump to testify and what are they going,to show what they're going to show is,this,let's go let me introduce something new,a historic moment march 1 1954.,that was a moment that four puerto rican,nationalist terrorists went into the,galleries of the house chamber same,house chamber were talking about on the,6th of january not much security in,those days nothing like magnetometers,they walked in they had handguns they,started shooting up the chamber,they killed they did not kill they,wounded five members of congress this,was a terrorist incident,i don't think donald trump knew that,history but,there's every sign now that that's the,kind of scene that he wanted on the 6th,of january because if you've got trump,getting that provocative speech on the,ellipse and now thanks to what we heard,from our testimony yesterday saying take,down the magnetometers let people with,all sorts of guns and other weapons roam,wild and march up to the capital what,else would he have had to in mind we,could have seen a scene where they would,have gone into the house chamber shot,all sorts of members of congress who,were on the house floor we know that,they were running after the office of,nancy pelosi other members of congress,they were screaming,hang my mike pence there was a gallows,outside don't know who put it up but,there's every sign now the evidence is,pointing to,donald trump that the centerpiece of a,plot to take down our democracy and stop,the peaceful transfer of power which,would have destroyed our democracy,central democratic tradition and you,could have had a mass assassination mitt,romney had to go running away from these,people who were invading the capital,that's what we could have seen and it,all goes back to what donald trump was,doing in the west wing on the 6th of,january,so michael let me also take you back to,another day uh in on capitol hill,in the 1950s it actually it was on june,the 1st 1950,margaret chase smith nervously waits,outside about to speak about to go in,and speak in the senate chamber joe,mccarthy just four months earlier had,started his witch hunt against uh,against uh americans claiming that that,they were communists,and uh mccarthy cornered her and said i,hear you're going to give a speech he,nervously said i am,and you're not going to like it,she went out and she delivered her,declaration of a conscience speech,and really,we had then,like we have now,we had a woman,willing to step forward,make a courageous stand,when all the men around her were cowards,it's just remarkable uh and and what is,so remarkable is even dwight eisenhower,would not stand up,for his mentor,general george marshall,when marshall got attacked by mccarthy,but margaret,shea smith the only woman,who was a united states senator at the,time in 1950 would do it and here we,have a 25 year old woman,who's worked for ted cruz who's worked,for steve scalise,who's worked for,some of the most conservative,pro-trump republicans,on capitol hill,having the courage to step forward,tell the truth and do what all of the,cowardly men around her,would not do,right,and and look at the contrast between her,this brave woman whom are children and,grandchildren they will know her name,and they have to honor him for what she,did yesterday she was the one person who,stood up to these people and said this,is what really happened and contrast,what was done yesterday with another day,joe and that is january 28,2021 eight days after donald trump left,office having done all of this,when the country needed an eminent,republican to stand up and say you know,whatever you may think of his policies,this is someone who was in bed with,domestic terrorists who wanted to,destroy our democracy instead what,happened was eight days after trump,leaves office uh kevin mccarthy flies,down to palm beach goes into the throne,room at mar-a-lago,and figuratively crawls to donald trump,has his picture taken side by side,smiling and basically said donald trump,is welcomed back into the heart of the,republican party and ever since then uh,trump's influence has rather than shrunk,which it should have done rather than,him being pursued for uh pursued for,what he did on the 6th of

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Michael Beschloss - Presidents of War: 1807 to Modern Times - 11/13/18

Michael Beschloss - Presidents of War: 1807 to Modern Times - 11/13/18

welcome to the Westminster town hall,forum where for 38 years we have engaged,the community and reflection and,dialogue on the key issues of our day,from an ethical perspective our,hour-long forums are free and open to,all and we invite you to join us in the,sanctuary of Westminster Church for,upcoming events information may be found,at Westminster forum org or on Facebook,Twitter and Instagram my name is Tim,Hart Anderson I'm the senior minister,here at Westminster Presbyterian Church,located on Nicollet Mall in beautiful,downtown Minneapolis and I'm the,moderator of the forum it's my pleasure,to introduce today's guest speaker,Michael Beschloss is an award-winning,author of nine books on presidential,history he is the presidential historian,for NBC News and a contributor to PBS,Newshour,a graduate of Williams College in,Harvard Business School he has served as,an historian for the Smithsonian,Institution and as a trustee of the,White House Historical Association the,National Archives Foundation and the,Thomas Jefferson foundation he's a,laureate of the Lincoln Academy of,Illinois and has been awarded the order,of Lincoln the state's highest honor his,books on the presidency include among,others the crisis years kennedy and,khrushchev 1960 to 1963 the conquers,Roosevelt Truman and the destruction of,Hitler's Germany and presidential,courage brave leaders and how they,changed America his latest book,presidents of war has been described by,a fellow historian as quote a superb and,important book and it's focused on the,president's role as commander in chief,is the topic of today's presentation,ladies and gentlemen please join me in,welcoming to the Westminster town hall,forum Michael Beschloss,thank you all very much,thank you so much for being here,everyone can hear and back I hope I,guess if you can't hear you can wave but,I think I think we're probably okay,thank you so much Tim for those,extremely nice words tim has carefully,instructed me to remained in time to,make sure I don't talk too long and,there's a problem here because I've bet,that one or two of you remember the name,Hubert Humphrey maybe free with great,admiration I think all of us especially,given where he was from and as those of,you who remember Humphrey will remember,Hubert was great but he didn't talk,short some of those speeches were about,three hours and I always remember that,once even he knew that he was talking,too long and he yelled out to the,audience,anybody here got a watch and someone,yelled back how about a calendar so I I,will keep his words in mind and try to,make sure I don't go on too long thank,you all so much for being here in fact,also reminds me of hump the president,under whom Humphrey served Lyndon,Johnson who built his presidential,library at the beginning of the 1970s,and not too many people came because,people were very angry about the Vietnam,War and true story so Johnson called the,guy who makes announcements at the,University of Texas football stadium at,halftime across the street he told him,anyone make an announcement at halftime,next time during the game saying anyone,who wants to use the bathroom can come,across the street and use the one of the,Johnson library and thousands of people,flowed through the front doors and the,Johnson library was then the best,attended Presidential Library,in the united states so you'll learn,something from these politicians you've,taken a real risk by inviting me here,today to talk about my book it took 10,years to write and if I talk in,proportion to the length of time it took,me to write I think you will all be here,about three weeks from now and I'll,still be talking so Tim I promise to,keep this brief the reason I wrote this,book presence of war is because I think,we have gotten into too many wars in,American history and so I wanted to,write about the eight or nine presidents,who were responsible and to figure out,why what their experience was like only,eight or nine people in American history,have had this experience of engaging the,United States in major Wars front with,major casualties and I write from James,Madison all the way up to Lyndon Johnson,would have written about george w bush,but I can't do it is history yet because,I think that that really requires about,40 years or so until you get sources and,enough hindsight to see these things as,history and not just as current events,but one thing that really does unite all,of these presidents of war is that every,single one of them became more religious,under the strain of leading the United,States into a major war Abraham Lincoln,when he was a young man was famous as a,skeptic or agnostic or some thought even,an atheist when he was in New Salem,Illinois,Tim's in my home state and one of his,old friends came to see Lincoln when he,was a war president in Washington the,last years of the Civil War and found,Lincoln reading a Bible and was shocked,said I never imagined that I would see,you reading a Bible and Lincoln said I

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Jan. 6th looks more important by the day, says historian Michael Beschloss

Jan. 6th looks more important by the day, says historian Michael Beschloss

michael with some separation from the,moment how do you now see history books,marking the day,uh it's looking more important in,history by the day ship and we talked,about that a year ago today a year ago,tonight,but you know here's a case where this,was an attack on the capital on the,congress is major more major than any in,american history since august of 1814,when the british burned out the,capital and the white house what is,going to make this more important in,history if we get evidence of this,beyond what we know right now is,was this abetted by sitting members of,congress,was this abetted or instigated by,members of the trump administration did,president trump himself was he involved,in an arrangement to,encourage this attack on the congress,and the capitol with the intention of,stealing the election and stopping the,certification of joe biden and stopping,the peaceful transfer of power,if that is the case and there's more and,more evidence that all this may be true,we may be seeing a situation where,nancy pelosi may have been up for,possible assassination or mike pence on,that gallows that was established,outside the capitol just today we're,learning that,kamala harris the vice president-elect,may have been vulnerable to violence,herself that day was there a connection,we don't know yet but here's a case,where we're finding out more and more if,you'll have me back a year from now and,hope you'll have me back before then but,a year from now we will know a lot more,you know though michael there are trump,supporters,all over america our neighbors and our,friends in many cases our loved ones,absolutely you know what,this was a this was a a demonstration,that became a riot that just sort of,boiled over,all of these suggestions that it's,something more than that are absurd and,by the way,the election was stolen and and,and president biden is illegitimate it's,not crazy talk it is what they believe,and therein lies the real bed of this,problem there are two sets of truths,that we can't seem to to to bridge and i,i don't know of a time,that's what i'm leaning on you had has,there been a time in history where we,couldn't even agree on the most basic,facts and how did we get out of it,because we're stuck nothing like this uh,you know if we were let's say we're,talking about the election of 1940 or,1900 there would have been conspiracy,theories like this the false tale that,donald trump won the 2020 election but,it was stolen from him that's not true,he lost by seven million popular votes,every effort to look at those results,suggests that that was true uh there,would be other conspiracy theories that,would lead to you know,things like antifa was behind the attack,on the capital you know that was also,not true but the point is shep that if,we were in 1900 or 1940,those theories would be mumbled by,someone on a street corner or handed out,in a hand bill they wouldn't get to very,many people,now we've got social media which is not,true for all of american history before,recent times and so you can have a crazy,theory like that that does not have,evidence and it will reach an audience,of billions of people that never,happened before and and that's the,difference between theories like this,earlier in history that were believed by,and reached a relatively small number of,americans and what's happened during the,last year where you have a former,president peddling a theory that does,not have evidence amplified by social,media and now a poll that finds that for,instance a majority of republicans,thinks that the election was stolen from,donald trump it wasn't,well you know i i feel like if if i,believed like to the core of my being,that the election had been stolen and,the democracy had been upended i don't,really know to what links i might do in,in protection of the country i'm not in,that position but but a lot of people,are,and is there something in history that,would suggest to us what people might do,given the fact that we realize some of,them michael,truly believe this and the way we've,communicated with each other throughout,this process has not been helpful at all,no that's exactly right and just as,you're saying shep there are a lot of,well-intentioned people who have been,listening to this and you know don't,have the time to go in and research this,and you know discover whether their,sources of information are,reliable or not that's also been true in,american history but the point is that,are you willing to allow the fate of our,democracy to depend on that situation,i'm not,and therefore people who,you know have reverence for a fact as,you you do and i do i think just have to,say donald trump lost the election these,people had no business being in the,capital it was violent it was a threat,against one of the fundamental,institutions in our society which is,congress and the capital,and there is a very easy scenario under,which we could have lost our democracy a,year ago,had that rebellion succeeded what i'd,

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Watch News Host's Face as He Instantly Regrets Having This Guest On | ROUNDTABLE | Rubin Report

Watch News Host's Face as He Instantly Regrets Having This Guest On | ROUNDTABLE | Rubin Report

well with just three days before this,big election uh MSNBC which as I always,tell people if you watch it knowing that,it's a televised mental institution it's,much more entertaining uh they're trying,to freak people out to the highest level,I mean this one was truly this is truly,truly bananas here's a presidential,historian on uh what's about to happen,this speech seemed in some senses more,specific about the developments that,we're seeing everywhere from the Arizona,poll stalkers to the Secretary of State,who who refuse to uh say that they'll,accept the elections what do you view as,the key takeaway of the speech tonight,we could be six days away from losing,our rule of law and losing a situation,where we have elections that we all can,rely on a historian will say what was at,stake tonight and this week was the fact,whether we will be a democracy in the,future whether our children will be,arrested and conceivably killed we're on,the edge of a brutal authoritarian,system and it could be a week away,Viva we're not only losing democracy uh,but they're also going to kill the,children I mean but what is going on,here I should have been wearing the,shirt that says confession through,projection because the only P the only,party that's been jailing people I'll,save I'll save the I'll I'll not get,into the killing of people but jailing,people,bastardizing democracy has been the the,party in power for the last two years,jailing Bannon jailing all of their,political adversaries acquitting all of,their you know political allies this man,is describing what the party that is,trying to preserve its control is and,has been doing it's confession through,projection through and through but my,goodness that's hyperbolic even for that,individual who I've never heard of,before,malice I take it that you'd be okay with,some kidnapping and killing of children,in the name of Liberty well only the fat,and ugly ones but I I do want to point,out that some of us do grow up that have,normal happy lives please and then but,Viva I just want to make your point you,just made my argument for me the,Democrats are imprisoning their,political opponents and and you get to,sit here and kind of roll your eyes and,laugh about it which of those two sides,is winning the people laughing or the,people doing the imprisoning which side,would you want to be on I I I'll if,malice you might call me the person who,would rather die than kill but I would,rather not be the people doing the evil,so uh in as much as I I think,repercussions for those who do I I would,not want to be that monster I wouldn't I,wouldn't feel better living with myself,like that than living as a victim of of,that type of violence okay and that is,exactly why America is in the state it's,in today because of people like you on,the right,I'm Canadian dude,well he also wisely moved to Florida,where we have some defenses against,against some of this stuff and by the,way Florida malice is doing some of the,things that you were asking some of the,states to do related to voting we are,encouraging uh in-person voting you have,to have an ID they're discouraging,mail-in ballots although they're doing a,little bit because of the hurricane so,there are it's a little easier I think,maybe for Viva to say it here in the,safety of Florida because it's true,rather than in Canada

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